Classics: 4 Unspoken Rules of Networking: Show Notes & Transcript

Post | Jul 08, 2025

Welcome back to Strategic Counsel by ForthRight Business! Looking for Marketing Smarts? You’re in the right place. After almost 4 years of helping to make you savvier marketers, we decided to broaden this podcast to include more business-oriented topics that will make you savvier business leaders.

In this episode, 4 Unspoken Rules of Networking, we focus on what NOT to do when networking effectively, comfortably, and authentically. Listen to the episode on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, and your other favorite podcast spots – follow and leave a 5-star review!

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Strategic Counsel by ForthRight Business: Classics: 4 Unspoken Rules of Networking

Remember the old adage: it’s not what you know, but who you know? Networking is fundamental to any person’s success in business – it doesn’t matter who you are. But, it’s not always easy to put yourself out there. In this episode, 4 Unspoken Rules of Networking, we focus on what NOT to do when networking effectively, comfortably, and authentically. This episode sets you up for networking success. We end with an unexpected – but fun – example: online dating apps! When is networking more important than when you’re trying to find your special someone? Here’s a small sample of what you will hear in this episode:

You have to build a well before you’re thirsty
How to find the networking strategy for your personality
Why networking is never truly over
How to network as an introvert?
Why is networking within my company not enough?

And as always, if you need Strategic Counsel, don’t hesitate to reach out to us at: ForthRight-People.com.

Check out the episode, show notes, and transcript below:

Show Notes

Classics: 4 Unspoken Rules of Networking
- [0:00] Welcome to Strategic Counsel by ForthRight Business
- [0:45] Networking success
- [2:43] It’s not easy to put yourself out there, but it’s worth it!
- [4:27] Rule 1: Don’t get drunk and overshare
- [6:49] Different environments work for different personality types
- [9:36] Rule 2: Don’t be the awkward networker
- [14:11] Rule 3: Don’t call people out of the blue and ask for something
- [18:37] You have to build a well before you’re thirsty
- [19:52] Rule 4: Don’t assume networking is over
- [23:58] You never know what else is there
- In-the-Trenches
- [25:21] How to network as an introvert?
- [28:04] Anne’s example
- [29:35] Networking during COVID
- [33:17] Not every meeting needs to be on video
- [36:00] What results can I expect from networking?
- [40:18] Why is networking within my company not enough?
- [45:13] What if the person I want to network with is higher up or more experienced?
- [49:26] Dating sites and networking
- [54:26] Make sure to follow Strategic Counsel by ForthRight Business on your favorite podcast spot and leave us a 5-star review on Apple Podcasts
- [54:40] Learn more at ForthRight-People.com and connect with us on Facebook, Instagram, and LinkedIn

What is Strategic Counsel?

Thanks for listening Strategic Counsel. Get in touch here to become more strategic.

Transcript

Please note: this transcript is not 100% accurate.

00:01
Welcome to the Strategic Counsel by Forthright Business podcast. If you’re looking for honest, direct and unconventional conversations on how to successfully lead and operate in business, you are in the right place. In our discussions, we push on the status quo and traditional modes of thinking to reveal a fresh perspective. This unlocks opportunity for you, your team and your business. Now let’s get to it. Welcome to the Strategic Counsel podcast.

00:31
I’m Anne Candido. And I am April Martini. And as we often do, we’re bringing back a previously recorded classics episode on a topic that is popular, or in this case, an episode that performed amazingly well from a metric standpoint. This time, it’s the four unspoken rules of networking. We talk about the importance of having a strong network with our clients consistently and are often met with an uncomfortable look or the feedback that it’s tough to be able to do this well. We get it.

00:57
However, you must be able to build and sustain a professional network if you want to grow your career and we tackle how to do just that in this episode. So with that, let’s get to it. This is definitely one of our passion areas. I know we’ve talked about having lots of them and it’s not just because this is what brought us together. We believe it is so fundamental to anyone’s success in business that we would be completely remiss not to have this as one of our topics. This is another one quite frankly where our careers on opposite sides of the fence bring a unique.

01:25
perspective to the do’s and don’ts of networking success. But again, topic for everyone, anyone working with a job, with a career, it does not matter who you are. You remember the old adage, it’s not about what you know, but who you know? It’s 100 % the truth. And this can be a hard pill to swallow, but unfortunately folks, that’s just the world we live in. And the other piece is you never quite know what’s gonna come out of networking.

01:50
We find this to be an extremely exciting topic just based on that fact because you don’t know where your efforts are gonna leave, but we will promise that they will lead somewhere. And we know there’s tons and tons of information out there about networking. So we’re gonna do a little bit of a flip and talk more about through the lens of what not to do. And some of them are slightly outrageous and you’re gonna be like, yeah, duh, I would definitely not do that. But the point here is to really appreciate the fact that while it’s

02:19
a broad topic, there’s lots of information out there. It’s always good to have a reminder and we think we bring a pretty unique point of view to the discussion that we want to share with everyone today. We also know it’s not always easy to put yourselves out there. So in the spirit of that, we want to help support all of you out there that either find it a struggle, have let it fall off, have never done it in the first place, all of those different things. Again, you can be anyone. That’s our topic for today.

02:49
Yeah, and I’m going to challenge the fact that if anyone hears us go through the topics and says, I’ve never done that, I’m going to call BS on that because we could say we’ve done every single one of these. I think if you hear that too and you’re like, yeah, that’s me, that’s OK. It’s been all of us. So that’s why we’re having this conversation. And we talk a lot about the way that networking led us actually to each other.

03:18
You’re gonna hear, you can hear all about that in episode six. It gives a background of our entire story, but you’ll recall if you’ve heard that episode already that I talk about the fact that I met somebody, that person asked me to meet this person, and that person said you should meet this person, and then that person’s what led me to April. So we call it the degrees of Kevin Bacon from a networking standpoint. But I just want you guys to keep that in mind as you are listening through this because

03:47
Sometimes it can get a little bit frustrating when you’re networking, because you kind of expect the first person you meet is going to be your April. And it may not be your April. Your April may be four steps removed, and you just have to go through the process in order to reach your April like I did. Yeah, exactly. And I think that’s a really good point, right? Because you set out with one objective. You’ve got to be flexible. Something else may come up. But what we will say is we’ve never heard anyone say that I never got anything out of networking if they do it the right way.

04:17
So with that in mind, we’re going to talk all about networking today and we’ll just jump right in. And then the four unspoken rules of networking. Oh yeah, sorry. Four unspoken rules of networking. That’s, that’s fair. So the first one, we cautioned, we might be a little outrageous here. Don’t get drunk and overshare. networking can be super hard, right? One of the ways to take the edge off is to have a drink or two before you actually get in the situation.

04:45
we would argue that this definitely helps you loosen up. However, it also can lower your inhibitions and skew your filter. So next thing you know, you’re telling your boss all about your fraternity initiations, which always started with, we were so drunk and then X happened, right? Not a good look, guys. If you’re in a networking, especially professional networking situation, this is pretty obvious. But…

05:12
The point we wanna make here is, there are ways that you can, if you can’t avoid the events, you can hold yourself to one or two drinks, you can have a wing person to watch over you, you can build kind of the discipline to deal with them if you have to, but the broader point here is to find an approach that works for you. So speaking very personally, early on in my career, the idea of networking was brought forth to me, which I totally appreciated, but…

05:38
The suggestion was to join lots of groups and boards and go to tons of networking events. I tried that for a hot minute and realized, first of all, I didn’t feel like this is what networking was about based on what I thought it was going to be. And also this was just a terrible investment of my time based on my personality. I’m not a schmoozer. I’ve never been a schmoozer. I don’t like people who schmooze. Those events are just so stiff and inauthentic.

06:08
I think that what you end up doing is doing a handshake and meeting people, but not really spending time having any meaningful conversation. So I still kept the idea in mind that I should find the right way to do it for me. And for me, that’s really one-on-one interactions, which I know if you’ve been listening to us or you know me, that might seem surprising because I am extroverted, right?

06:37
In theory, I should be able to embrace those types of situations and make them work for me. But because they just go against the grain of who I am as a human being, I actually prefer the one-to-one. And that’s because it allows for some really meaningful in-depth conversation with the person. You’re seeking each other out on purpose, or one of you is seeking the other out for a reason. There’s topics to discuss. You can relax. You can, you know…

07:07
decide what the right environment is, if it’s not over drinks, maybe it’s at a coffee shop, whatever the case might be, you’re much more in control and you’re in control of the speed. And I just love those conversations because honestly, no matter who it’s with, I always come away feeling refreshed. Like got a new perspective, I reconnected with someone that I truly care about and respect, and I’m kind of put in the right mood to go tackle something new for the day.

07:36
April, even though you don’t like to schmooze, mean, obviously almost everybody actually has to do that at some point, right? I mean, that’s always one of those things at the company Christmas party, although we’re not doing a lot of Christmas parties this year, do you have like tips that have helped you in those situations be able still to make them very effective networking opportunities? Yeah, and like we said, if you can’t choose, you know, and you have to get used to the situation you’re in, I mean,

08:06
I’ve also had plenty of that, right? So what I always had was I would prepare just like for any other sort of meeting or event. study whatever the topics were, if there were, or refresh myself on the client, if it was client specific. Keep in mind the handful of people that you absolutely have to have see you or speak to in the room.

08:32
make sure you have questions posed or smart conversation starters for that. And just really kind of run through in your head how to orchestrate the event to the best of your ability so that you feel somewhat in control entering the room, even though it’s not really your approach of choice. And so while I don’t love that way of doing things, I felt a lot more confident and ready to go.

09:01
in those situations if I prepared myself. Yeah, I think that makes a ton of sense. I think in doing that, it also helps you to kind of keep it a little bit more professional. Uh-huh, yes. Right, because I think when we say don’t get drunk and overshare too, like even if you’re not drinking, sometimes you start feeling very comfortable in a situation. Uh-huh. And that’s sensitively to oversharing too. So we highly suggest you keep it professional. Be careful where you go on those things. That’s why you have to be stiff as a board.

09:31
Very respectful of the fact that you have professional goals here in mind. Yes. Which actually segues nicely into the second point, which I’m going to hand off to you, which is don’t be the awkward networker. Right. And we’ve all been there, and we’ve all seen them, right? After you find the networking approach that you feel most comfortable with, the next step is really to make it a regular habit. Because it’s going to be

09:59
awkward at first. It’s awkward at first for everybody. But in order for this to be really effective for you, it’s going to have to start coming off authentic. You can’t be the awkward person who’s always just sitting there letting everybody else talk while you’re not saying anything, or the person who’s just kind of like, you know, standing in the room in the corner, which refusing to engage anyone.

10:26
that just doesn’t work. And they really, the only way to get over that is to actually start doing it. And the more you do it, the more comfortable you become with it. And the ways that you do that, and April had a lot of really good tips, is by really planning for those engagements. make sure that you do that, because that will help it not feel so overwhelming. You’ll have something that you can talk about. All of those things are going to be

10:54
really going to be really important in helping to make sure that the conversations you have are leading somewhere. like April said, it’s not just, hey, how’s the weather? Hey, how’s the weather? Hey, where are you from? Hey, where are you from? That you are able to start having intent in your conversations. And with that, when you can have intent, it helps to kind of take some of the awkwardness out as well. But I can’t overemphasize enough that you have to, have to, have to practice.

11:23
and you only practice by actually being in it and realizing it ain’t gonna be like smooth at the beginning and that’s totally fine. You’ll get better at it and there’s gonna be some days where you’re just gonna be off and it’s not gonna be perfect but always try to take something away from what you have because there’s always the opportunity to follow up later. And really what we would say is you haven’t networked until you actually.

11:48
follow up. That’s where the connection actually gets solidified and gets made. So there should be some exchange of LinkedIn or there should be some exchange of email or something to the effect of, you know, some expectation for follow up. That doesn’t mean necessarily you’re doing that with everybody, but you’re doing it with certain folks. I think that’s those are really important ways to help you kind of get over the awkwardness. Yeah. And I think Anne and I,

12:18
We talk about our pet peeves right now because networking is happening in theory on some of those channels. So she mentioned LinkedIn. I feel like I’ve been getting a lot of emails lately, but where people, to the point of doing the wrong thing, are trying to network by incessantly emailing you or LinkedIn posting to you. Yeah, LinkedIn cold calling. I’ve said it before. I’ll say it a million times. It drives me absolutely nuts when somebody says,

12:47
Hi, Ann, I have researched your company. I can offer you and then proceed to offer me exactly what we sell. Yes, exactly. It happens all the time. And then they follow up and say, oh, I don’t mean to bug you. Since you didn’t answer me the first time, how about now? And you want to see what I prepared for you? And then you still don’t answer. I’m like, third time, what’s it going to take for me to actually get a response from you? I’m like, gracious, people. It’s just not appropriate. It’s not appropriate. mean, it’s not going to lead to.

13:16
healthy conversions. mean, and it just gets people annoyed because it’s so clearly obvious that you really didn’t spend any time in doing that. so, and my other like close second to that is, hi, can we have 30 minutes of your time just to tell you what I got going on? Like, no, you can’t have 30 minutes of my time just to tell me what you got going I don’t know who you are. Why would I do that? And maybe it’s converting for some people, but I…

13:43
just have a hard time believing that that is effective. And it just, you just lose so much reputation and credibility that the first thing I’m gonna do is just really on like how you do it in LinkedIn, but like basically remove them. I just can’t handle it. Yeah, so cold calling that leads very nicely into the next point, which is don’t call me out of the blue and ask me for something. And okay, that LinkedIn example, that’s great, right?

14:11
But even worse, I feel like when you have someone that you actually do know, and it’s usually someone that’s either an acquaintance or someone that you haven’t talked to in a long time and you knew at some point in your career, but you don’t really know them now, they just randomly call you or email you or reach out and there’s an immediate ask associated with it. And not only is that just jarring in and of itself because I’m like, we don’t have any sort of rapport or whatever.

14:38
I’m automatically put on the defensive and feel very uncomfortable most often with the ask. And it’s tied up into a bunch of things, right? Like I haven’t talked to you in forever. A lot of times the ask feels unnatural in general or not really applicable, or they’re asking for the world. And I’m like, but we don’t even, we either barely know each other, we haven’t talked in years, all of those types of things. And so…

15:02
One of the things, you we’ve talked already about getting comfortable with the idea of networking and then Anne talked about practicing so that you start to lean into it a little more and affect your style. But she also said, you know, the follow-up. so I think here it’s about setting a cadence to the networking and it’s honestly not going to be the same for everybody. So I would say right now, even amidst COVID,

15:29
I have a monthly mentoring session with someone that I used to work with who’s looking for advice, a monthly lunch with someone I used to work with that we reconnected after years of just not talking to each other, after running into each other a few times, a monthly session with someone who I hold very near and dear, and we talk about the fact that we’re both starting our own thing or in the midst of being in our own thing and giving advice, but also just talk bigger picture about the world.

15:58
And then there’s people, know, like half a dozen of them who I reach out to once a quarter and I put that actually in my calendar. And that doesn’t mean we necessarily get together once a quarter, but it means that at least there’s a connection point. It might be a quick catch up. We schedule something, you know, those monthly meetings, even sometimes those shift. But the point is that networking is a priority and I value it so much that I’m totally willing to handle all the logistics.

16:25
take ownership of it. And like I said, back to the point of those one-on-one meetings in the beginning is that we’re not starting from scratch every time. We actually truly are having meaningful conversation because it’s not like, I haven’t talked to you in a year, oh my gosh, your kids are how old and to the point of like, what’s the weather? Like, what vacation did you go on this year? All that stuff. We can jump into, know, remember last time I was having a struggle with X, Y, and Z issue and…

16:51
you know, well, yeah, tell me how that went. Well, here’s how it panned out. Like, what do you think about how I handled it? Right? And so it quickly gets to a meaningful interaction, which to me is the true point of networking because it’s authentic in the way that it’s happening. Now, do you have to be as crazy as I am about it? No.

17:11
talked about the fact that I’m very OCD. I like my checklist. If I don’t put it on my calendar, then it pops into my head at 3 a.m. Oh my gosh, I haven’t talked to so and so and so long. that’s totally my way of managing it. And I would say, honestly, it’s a light year for me with COVID and actually seeing people in person. But you also don’t have to engage as much as I do. I love it. So I make it a priority. It’s just more that you have to do it. So again, finding what works for you.

17:40
and then ultimately setting a cadence to those meetings is just hugely, hugely important. Yeah, and I think the one thing that you said too, that I think is really important, or you applied it, is that you’re selective. Yeah, oh yeah. Right? So it’s not like everybody you meet, have to follow up with and you have to set a cadence for and connect with them. You’re selective on who is going to win.

18:05
give you energy, who is going to, or who you want to give energy to in addition to, who might be good business acquaintances that we want to engage with later, who are just great from a mentoring standpoint. mean, there’s lots of different reasons why you might network with somebody and want to connect with them on an ongoing basis. And Jordan Harbiger, who is one of my podcasters I listen to, he always says,

18:32
you have to build a well before you are thirsty. Yep. So I think that’s always a good thing to kind of keep in mind too, is that choose some that you feel like are going to have some short-term impact on you and whatever is important for you in the networking realm. And then some of might long term be like, I don’t know how this relationship is going to work now, but it’s a very interesting relationship and it’s something that I want to kind of foster and keep going. And it might pay dividends later. And then if there is somebody that you

19:02
haven’t kept in touch with and you do want to reach out with them out of the blue, just be honest about that. say, I know I haven’t talked to you in like two years, but I have this going on. I thought of you. Do you have a couple of minutes? if you’re not interested, I totally understand. We haven’t talked, but I think it could be cool or whatever, how you want to position it. Just be honest in that and just say right out. think people will appreciate that a lot more and you’ll get a lot better response from that.

19:31
I think that’s really, really important is to be selective so that you can manage it. Otherwise you could spend every day, all day, you know, doing all the networking things and then wondering kind of what is going to be in it for you. Yes. And what’s going to be like the result of your time. So. Absolutely. Totally fair point. All right. So number four, fourth and final. And I’m going to hand this one to Anne.

19:59
Don’t assume networking is ever over. Yeah, I used to find this kind of funny. And actually, I’ll be honest, it was me too. It’s like, why do I need to do this? I know enough people, right? And that could be an easy cop out because I am introverted and it was an easy way to get out of having to do the networking. But if I had really just like really felt that and I actually hadn’t

20:29
really continue to expand my network, I would have been really in big trouble when I left P &G. And I think that’s really, really important for people to know is that you don’t know where life is going to take you. You don’t know what tomorrow is going to bring. If anything this pandemic has taught us is that, right? That life is unpredictable. You don’t know where you’re going to be tomorrow. Lots of things can happen. So it’s always good to continue to connect and grow.

20:57
your network because it gives you a ton of flexibility then if something does happen. Continue to think about too where you want to expand your network. So sometimes, you know, if you really have a tight network internally and in your business and that’s working well for you, you might want to say, is there networks outside of my business then that would be very beneficial for me to start engaging in.

21:23
that I can start building some rapport with some people in that area. Cause maybe you have a, you know, eventually gonna wanna do a side hustles. We’ve talked about that. So maybe you want to start getting involved in some entrepreneurial networks that are gonna allow you to have access to this world that you don’t have access to. Maybe you wanna pursue a personal passion and you you don’t know exactly how you’re gonna get there. And maybe you just need to be around the right people that actually feel that passion too.

21:51
And whether it’s religious or music or art or anything that philanthropy that you find meaning in, you might just want to start networking with those groups. So it’s an opportunity to really just expand and grow yourself as much as grow the physical presence of you through all of these different groups that are going to give you.

22:19
You know, make your life richer, but also going to provide flexibility in this ever-changing world. Yeah, and I think it broadens your perspective just naturally. Yeah, I agree. So, you know, whether you do it in your company, like Ann said, or you proactively go out and find new interests to link to, I mean, I don’t think that there’s much that can replace a different perspective than what you do every single day. So I think it’s really easy to fall into the, you know,

22:49
at the office from nine to five or six or seven or whatever and then where am gonna find the energy? But I think that’s a backwards way of thinking because I think you find the energy by networking with people that are outside of the realm of your every single day. And I just think it’s so important. And then just the point of not assuming it’s ever over. mean, people come in and out all the time. And so you have to be open.

23:18
to everything from graciously, like we don’t have a lot to talk about anymore, which has happened to me. And then to Anne’s earlier point, it’s still okay. The door’s open. You can reach out a year or two from now when you think of them and you need something to, you know, I’m looking for X, Y, and Z in my life and I want to bring some new people in. So it’s just something that never changes and that if you proactively do it right, can consistently fill you back up and help you see things a new way.

23:47
Yeah, and I think to that point is you never quite know exactly what else is there when you start engaging with somebody. I I can’t tell you how many networking conversations I’ve had or just conversations in general that I go in with one intent and I find out, well, I didn’t even know that’s possible.

24:10
you know, that ends up in business. But this was like, supposed to just supposed to be a pure personal, like, you know, connect that I had set up because I thought the person was kind of cool and I wanted to learn more about the person. I mean, it’s always interesting how matrixed it can be. And that’s part of what networking allows you to see, but also it gives you time for those things to develop. Especially if you do everything that we told you to do, which like set the cadence.

24:38
and be authentic in it, you’d be surprised how much stuff opens up. when you give it enough time, what possibly can, or something that thought initially develops that you didn’t even realize that could develop, right? So yeah, I think that was, definitely always need to be thinking about networking. Yeah, I mean, it keeps you top of mind. I think that’s the point, right? So whether that business opportunity comes up in the actual conversation or three months down the road,

25:08
they’re reminded of you because you put yourself in front of them. Yeah. Now, unfortunately, I didn’t give April any of that time, but you know, I gave her a little bit of time. True. So now that we’ve set up how to effectively network through the lens of what not to do, we’re going to move on to the segment of In the Trenches. And for those of you that listen regularly, you know that this is where we give real world examples that are specific maybe to industries or situations, but

25:35
broadly applicable for anybody to digest and put into action. the first one here, and Ann kind of already touched on this, but I’m going to pass this to her. I am an introvert and I have a hard time putting myself out there to network. What do you suggest? Yes, and this is where I’ve said it.

25:52
once I’ll say it a million times, sometimes you just gotta do things that make you uncomfortable. And yes, like we already mentioned, it’s gonna be awkward at first. But this is why you really need to think about what’s the best environment for you to be able to network. April mentioned the one-on-one situations and how that helps her facilitate those conversations and create more meaningful relationships. It tends to be what works for me as well. I tend to like the one-on-ones or small group settings, but sometimes even small group settings, I…

26:20
I feel a little lost in the conversations. And so I’m not quite sure how to operate, because usually in a small group, like a couple people know each other much better. Unless I happen to be one of the people that knows the other person better, and then I feel more comfortable in this situation. But April also gave you guys a lot of other really good tips. Plan, plan, plan for the conversation. Have some questions. Like know a little bit about the person enough to have some questions ready.

26:50
And then when they respond, listen, and then ask them a follow-up question. So it’s kind of like the techniques we use in products research, which is to really start kind of just pulling it out of them, be pulling out of them by being interested and asking them questions, ask them to elaborate. And then you’ll find something that you’re able to connect on, and then you can elaborate based on that. So I think that’s a really good way of helping you feel a little

27:16
Helping it feel a little less awkward in kind of getting over it a little bit of the shyness. But that assumes that you’ve already made the effort to actually plan it and do it. So you have to do that. You have to do that. if you need to, make them smaller. Make them smaller sessions, 30 minutes. So it doesn’t feel as daunting. Like, what am going to talk about for an hour over dinner? Make it a 30 minute coffee session or a quick call or a Zoom call.

27:44
So you know that it’s only 30 minutes and that you won’t get stock over a dinner or something like that. But even in those situations, it could be okay. So I’ll give a little story. was meeting a person who ended up being one of our bankers for our investment portfolio. And I was meeting him at a restaurant and I was there first. And actually another one of my caveats is,

28:13
always get there first and make them find you. Yes. Because that takes a little bit too of the awkwardness out of it and a little bit of the shyness of having to go in and try to find somebody. But that all being said, there was a guy who came in and he looked like he was looking for somebody. I’m like, hey, are you Steve? And he goes, yeah, I’m Steve. I’m like, oh, we’re meeting to discuss this. He goes, I must not be that Steve. So I had a big laugh about that. And then the other Steve came in and we had our meeting. I was like, and I that a couple of weeks later with somebody else. There was a

28:42
was a Jenny and I was like, oh yeah, I’m Jenny. I’m like, oh, you’re just Jenny? No, I’m not that Jenny. I’m like, oh my gosh, what’s my problem? So, and sometimes when you can laugh at yourself, it helps you get over a little bit of shyness too. Yeah, well, and I think there, you heard a lot of good tips for making yourself more comfortable and taking control of the situation. So like for the example of getting there and being there first, you you don’t want to run in all harried either. Like give yourself time. If you know this is already going to make yourself uncomfortable, then.

29:09
get there early, sit down, have your drink ready, have your pad out, like don’t be zipping in there and then you’re already starting at a deficit and you aren’t awkward or you’re already feeling awkward about it. So, I mean, I think it’s about being thoughtful and then finding the right approach and then controlling the situation as best as you can. Mm-hmm, agreed. All right, just like everything else in the world, this is number two, networking has been affected by COVID, what now? So I gave the insight into my current next…

29:38
working situation. And I think the point here is not to let current circumstances or any circumstance give you an excuse in and out not to network or to let it fall off entirely. So I’ll give you a really specific example. And I probably mentioned this before because I really hate it. I loathe video chatting. I seriously hate it. I feel like I have to gear up.

30:05
so much energy to do it and focus so hard and it’s just not natural for me. However, I will say, I mentioned that I mentor someone once a month and Elizabeth and I just find that we communicate far better on camera. And so I will say that I truly, truly look forward to seeing her on camera on the last Friday of every month and having that chat with her. And I think…

30:32
You know, it wasn’t great at first because of, like I said, me and I’m awkward on camera, but now we’ve settled into a really nice cadence where it feels natural and comfortable with her because I’m used to it now. And so, you know, for those of you listening saying, well, whatever, April loves networking, so this is easy for her. I mean, that was not such an easy thing for me to do, but I made the shift for that reason. Now, I will also say that there’s been some other examples where

31:02
I suffered through the awkwardness of talking on the phone for the first three minutes with someone that I adore and have great in-person conversation with, but we never talk on the phone to each other. And so, like, you know, those are people that, like, we can have a good laugh, where I’m like, why are we having so much trouble getting started? This is not a formal conversation, you know, those kind of joking moments. But I could have just as easily been like, oh, God, this is so awkward, and, gotten off the phone as quickly as possible versus addressing and working with things in the moment. So…

31:31
I mean, I think the ask of a lot of people right now by their companies is to network. I actually wrote a blog post about this. if you want some very specific tips on how to get started and what to do, especially in our current environment, you can go to our website and find that. But I think the encouragement, right, is to mix with people both in your company but also outside. There’s also all kinds of things about mental health going on right now and

32:01
people being secluded and not interacting. I think the point is that not being physically with people does not mean not socializing. And to me, that’s the support for networking and even more than ever the reason to do it. So again, don’t let current circumstances hinder you. Be authentic and honest. I I will say to a new client, yes, I’ll do a video call, but I will tell you right now I’m awkward on the video. Like, I just will because then it lets them know that

32:30
I may not be as good as what they’re used to over email or the phone or in person if they’re used to me that way. But don’t let it be an out for yourself because I think a lot of people have just been like, well, you know, I’m the usual, oh, it’s on my performance review to network. Okay, I talked to Susie from ex department that I kind of know. We did a walk around the campus of the office for 20 minutes, checked the box, networking’s done. And those are the people that I think are.

32:58
are probably not embracing the situation we’re in now. Yeah, think, to have a couple of points just to build on what you said. One is, I find it really funny now that everybody feels like every meeting has to be a video meeting. Even meetings that you would normally not even have as a video meeting, people feel like they have to have a video meeting. It’s like, you don’t have to make this more than it actually is, right? If you would normally talk on the phone.

33:23
talk on the phone, maybe you might want to throw in a video meeting every now and then, but like you don’t also have to feed somebody else’s need for the way that they want to network if it doesn’t make you feel comfortable. And as April has laughed at me a gazillion times, I have bandwidth issues on my wifi. So if all my kids are at home doing at home learning and my husband’s on his like computers doing work, like I have bandwidth issues. And so it gives me a tremendous amount of anxiety trying to find the right place. I could be able to do a video call.

33:51
because my internet will go in and out. And then all of a sudden everybody’s like, Anne, can’t hear you, Anne, you froze again. I’m like, geez, oh my goodness. So I think that’s just one thing is like, you don’t have to have a video conference for everything or a Zoom call or whatever. It’s okay to do it by phone. And for those people too who have said, oh, I’m just so much better in person. I’m just gonna ride all this out until I can do in-person meetings.

34:18
get over it. mean, you guys, this is gonna be how it’s gonna be for a little while. It’s gonna go up and down. there’s gonna be people who are not gonna feel comfortable being in person for while. And then, I mean, that’s awkward, too, where you have to show up with your mask and then you have to sit down and then you have to get, like, there’s just a lot of awkwardness in a social situation right now, either. Anyway, so you’re gonna have to figure out how to communicate and network through a different medium, even if it’s not one that you’re traditionally, like, happy with. And you can’t say, oh, I’m just not very good on the phone.

34:47
you’re gonna have to learn how to get better on the phone. And we told you, the way that you do that is by practice. It’s not gonna be easy the first couple of times, but you’re going to learn how to do it. And if you guys are struggling with it, give us a call, we will help you. We’re like tried and true practitioners of all the different methods. And so we can definitely help you with this. And I think the one last point I would say on this is sometimes if you are gonna bring people together, in a group setting, especially on the video conference and stuff like that,

35:17
trying not to make it overdone. I know people are trying to do themes and stuff like that, and that can be fine in certain circumstances, but sometimes that makes it even worse is when you try to make something more than what it is. And so that can really throw people off too. So just a couple of builds. Yeah. No, I think all of that is totally fair and to the point. And the only last thing I would say is

35:44
If you learn some new skills and you get better at those, imagine how easy networking is going to be when you get to go back to what you prefer. So you can live that way too. you like it the other way better. Totally. All right. Number three, what results can I expect from putting in the effort to network? So we’ve talked about the fact that we at least find networking super exciting because you can’t really predict the results. And that’s totally true. But what we can tell you is if there are things that you want to

36:14
work on or questions you’re asking yourself or things you want to explore, you can set goals for yourself or rules for yourself around networking to feel like you’re accomplishing something. before Ann said, you know, don’t network with everyone the same way for the sake of networking. You could spend all your time networking and then be like, what the heck am I doing this for in the first place? That’s not obvious. That’s not what you want to do. But here I think it’s it’s like

36:42
for me, and I’ve talked about my journey to finding Anne before, but I kind of started my own thing, did it for a whole year, felt like I had mastered where I was at that point in time, but was looking for something else. And so it was, just don’t turn down any meeting, right? That was it. And so then I never really gave thought if someone reached out and then I would tell people that and then they would connect me to other people. And so over time I started to become…

37:11
the person known for that reputation, which of course led me to Anne and this podcast and things that I never thought that I would do. We have our own show now. I had never even been on anyone’s podcast. But in addition to the super monumental things, by the end of last year, I was interacting with just as many new people as people that I had known for a long time. And three of those people are now people that are on kind of that quarterly or

37:38
or bi-yearly or whatever list where number one, we send each other messages when we think of each other. we’ve, you know, we’re Facebook friends now, so we comment on the kids and all of that stuff. But I do get together with those people now. And so lots of big things, lots of small things. But I think in the way of looking for something new, there were a lot of new things that I wouldn’t have anticipated that came out of it just by me putting myself out there to network. And so my effort

38:09
my results rather, far outperformed any effort in my mind because looking back to the beginning of the year, I’m an entirely different person. Yeah, I think to keep in mind is it’s very hard to do anything as a Lone Ranger. Yeah. It’s very hard to accomplish goals, dreams, objectives, just

38:37
by yourself, so by natural, just how the world works, you have to network. So even by saying, you know, I don’t really want to do that, you have to, or you might as well just, like, know, live in your basement and, you know, even if you’re playing video games, you’re networking. So, you know, it’s really, like, it’s the nature of the beast. You’re gonna have to do it anyway. So think about, like,

39:05
Again, like what you said too, the intent of why you’re networking, what are you hoping to get out of it? What is the goal? Not that you have to go in with everything with an agenda, but that’s how you’re selective. That’s how you know what people you actually want to continue to engage with or what people you might want to go try to find. So there should be a level of intent there. There should be a level of almost like strategy of like, where is this going to do for me or how is this going to fulfill me in my endeavors?

39:32
because you are going to need people in order to make things happen for you. There’s just no other way around it. Yeah, no, it’s so true. And I think to not getting frustrated with the process and knowing that you kind of have to wait for results is just another thing to keep in mind. So you can’t overmanage it. You can’t predict it. You can set it up the best way you think you know how, but don’t let yourself get

40:02
discouraged and also don’t have tunnel vision. So be on the lookout for results outside of what you have in your head already. Yeah, I think that’s a point. So number four, which I’m going to hand off to Anne, why is networking inside my company not enough? So I think I alluded to this in one of our earlier points, but let me elaborate on it a little bit more, is that if I had just networked within my company when I left P &G, I would have been in big trouble.

40:32
because my internal network wasn’t enough in order to springboard my new business. And again, even if it wasn’t work related, just hanging out with the people that I worked with wouldn’t have been enough in order to really fulfill me in other areas of my life. And through that, I was able to extend into different opportunities that really

40:59
made everything a lot more fulfilling and then opened up other opportunities. And so it’s just too limiting if that’s all you’re going to stick to because you’re really just thinking then what is this group people to be able to do for me here in this moment within this company versus who do I want to surround myself with so that I could grow as a person and actually have a more fulfilling life. So, I mean, just to kind of finish the point about from a career perspective,

41:28
When I left P &G, I thought all my other P &G connects were going to be the springboard for my business. It turned out to be actually very different. It ended up being actually people who were not within P &G that became the springboards for my business. Or those people were the ones who actually introduced me to the right people that did help me springboard my business. Now I still have a couple P &G people that I talk to on a regular basis and I find

41:55
you know, them very helpful and just especially context, because, you know, they get out of the matrix and they’re able to, you know, provide some perspective on from how it’s been for them. But I’m finding like their journey has been very, very different than mine. So if I hadn’t built those relationships, if I hadn’t networked, if I hadn’t been intentional in creating that ecosystem around me.

42:21
I would have been in really big trouble and it would have been a whole lot scarier than it was and it would have taken me a whole lot longer in order to be able to move things forward and I’m a pretty impatient person anyway. Yeah and I think you know we’ve talked about the difference with agencies and I think networking happens more naturally because we just tend to jump around more right so very few people spend 20 years at the same agency so but I think even with that said

42:51
I always kind of took along my key handful of people, whether it was, you know, to Anne’s earlier point about the reason for it. Some were pure friendship, but then I can tap into them to help us with work for forthright people. Some are more business oriented where, you know, they’re still within the agencies and I want to have that perspective continue. So I meet with them.

43:14
to give feedback and then they ask me questions about the way we’re approaching it that they might be able to learn something to do within their organization. you know, I think being intentional about not losing contact every time you leave a company and then also keeping those important relationships that you’ve chosen on the networking track is hugely important. And I think you mentioned an important point too about perspective.

43:42
just gives you the other side of the coin. I mean, you can get very myopic in the one company you’re in thinking that’s the only way that it’s done. you know, I know we always talk about bringing the outside in and I think that was more figuratively talk and actually talk. I love hearing you say that. I will be honest because like you try to bring the outside in and of course the structure doesn’t support the outside, it supports the inside. So.

44:08
But you can at least get the perspective from the outside that, there’s a different way of thinking about things. It increases your diversity of thought. It makes you more open to new ideas, fresh ideas, new ways of doing things that then you can work into the way that you operate within your business, even if you don’t plan it to go anywhere. It just broadens your perspective and gives you appreciation to maybe how the agency operates, if you really understand that. So you can understand

44:38
how they feel, or your vendors, if you’re in one of your manufacturing situations, so really understanding how they feel. And sometimes it’s very eye-opening when you have those relationships by how much easier the work is facilitated when you understand each other and you have that relationship. So it’s very important to be thinking outside of your little bubble no matter where you are. Yeah, and then acting against it. And acting against it for sure.

45:09
All right, our fifth and final. What if the person I want to network with is more experienced or higher up the food chain than where I am? So first thing I will say here is people love to talk about themselves, period. And I am totally included in that. So full disclosure. But speaking from my personal experience, I was lucky enough to never be turned down by anyone when asking for networking opportunities. Now, I will say that with the caveat that

45:39
I also wasn’t entirely brave all the time about going for the super big fish. So there’s definitely a balance of that. But what that did for me is cultivated a desire to go and pay that back. I just, so many of the opportunities that I was led to in life were because of the networking situations that I found myself in. So back to the very beginning where we talked about, it’s not about what you know, but who you know, I just found that to be so, so important.

46:08
Thinking very early on, which I kind of reference with this question as someone who’s newer to the job world and to networking, the ones that I look back on still with the most awe, if you will, are the ones where I did get someone that was director level or 20 years of experience and here I am this baby in the job.

46:31
but that would willingly sit down and talk to me and treat me as if I were an equal in the way that no question I asked was stupid and would, know, well, why did you ask that? And encourage me to talk more about my point of view and really wanted to get to know me. And so I think that’s the perspective that I take anyway. And I think people that have had similar experiences, that’s what they try to do.

46:54
Now on the other side, people get busy, right? So Ann talked about being selective. I talked about how many networking meetings I have just regularly on my calendar. There are some that I just quite frankly can’t get to. So don’t be discouraged if that does happen to you. I mean, it’s gonna happen. Don’t take it personally. That person doesn’t know you. And so those can be kind of like off-putting. You’re like, oh, well shoot, that didn’t work out. So now I’m not gonna try anymore.

47:22
That’s not what we’re talking about here. think the point here is give it a shot. We always say test and learn. We talk about that all the time, but if someone says no, then just move on. And it doesn’t mean that it doesn’t open an opportunity for later or, maybe you run into them again, all of those types of things happen. Um, but just get right back on the horse and, keep on trying and be brave or as brave as you can be about it. Because in the moments when I looked back and I did take a chance.

47:52
those are the ones that just stick out so clearly in my mind. So that would just be my recommendation there. Yeah, and I think depending on who it is, you can actually set them up for letting them know that you’re going to be back in asking again. Because a lot of the big, usually the response you’ll get is, I would love to, but I’m too busy. It’s like, oh, I understand. I’ll follow up with you next month and see if you’re less busy.

48:16
And so they’re like, oh gosh, this person is not gonna go away. And that could be a different dynamic. I get it if you’re talking like inside your company versus outside your company, but geez, no guts, no glory sometimes. mean, the worst thing you’re gonna get is like, no, I’m sorry, I can’t do that. Or maybe they won’t respond, but how are gonna feel if you never try? so always, I mean, I think it’s important to at least put it out there, but not take it, like you said, personally.

48:44
if the person does not have time to meet you. They just don’t know how awesome you are, not yet. Well, and in this situation, one of my favorite words that I never get to use is gumption. And I just feel like that’s the perfect word to describe what you need in order to keep putting yourself out there. So anyway, just a point that, again, don’t take it personal. Keep trying.

49:10
Go for who you want to. The worst that they can say is no and be persistent.

49:17
All right, so again, for all of our listeners, you know that our third and final segment is usually a real world example, either good or bad, of someone pertaining to the topic or a company pertaining to the topic that’s either doing a good job or a bad job. And in this case, we’re talking about networking. So this is a fun one, caveat. I have zero personal experience in this space, but…

49:44
I have seen it work and work with my very close network. And so to the point of networking, we’re going to talk about dating sites. And the reason I don’t have experience is I’m old and I met my husband in college when they didn’t even exist. literally never been on them, never really had a reason to. But what I will say is that there are several successful examples of people who have found their people on these sites.

50:14
And we’ve talked a lot in the past about over-saturation, and I think this is surface level where you might be like, oh my gosh, there’s so many sites, and how do I even get started, and how do I know? But the ones that are doing a really good job are doing it in a creative way that takes into account the types of people they want to attract and where there might be natural common interest. And then they can go forth and kind of, on steroids, put you together with the right people. So as an example.

50:41
E-Harmony, faith-based. So that’s a good entry point for people to start a conversation. There is Bumble, which allows the woman to make the first move in swiping right if she’s interested in the person she’s being matched with. There’s Tinder, there’s Lumen for people over 50, there’s NUIT, which now brings your birth charts into things. So if you’re into your horoscope and all of that philosophy, it matches people at that much higher level.

51:10
The list goes on and on and obviously there are some very bad ones out there. But what I think about this that’s interesting is that, you know, we talked about finding the right people that you want to network with. And I think when a company or an organization can find the right way to do that at a much higher level, they’re showing their networking skills in the way the platform is effective. So

51:40
Again, three people in my close circle, this is kind of a tough one to think about a brand that’s a good networker. But I think just organically the way that these sites work, but also the effort and conscientiousness with which they put forth the brand and the way the platforms work. When it’s down to the core of who they are, it works really well. Yeah, and I actually am one of those three people. I met my husband. I wasn’t going to call you out. Yes, I did. I’ll say it.

52:08
My brother might kill me, but he bet his wife on harmony. But anyway, that all being said, the point you’re trying to make is a really good point, is that these sites are basically differentiating themselves by catering to the style for which people want to network. So when we’re talking about finding your style, you’re, mean.

52:31
I mean, just in the basic, like just using match as an example, I mean, that was for people who didn’t basically wanna meet somebody in a bar for the first time, right? So that’s very awkward for you to go on a social setting and meet somebody in a bar. This was actually called the lookbook of men. It’s like you can like order men online almost, know, like a new shop online. But it was basically how it was set up. And then you could just like put a little wink out there, you know, just to kind of test the waters, you know. So it was a much safer way into…

53:00
trying to beat somebody, then it would be if you’re like, okay, I’m gonna go cruising the bar scene and trying to find somebody there. Now, ironically, a lot of our tips for how to network effectively apply here. Don’t get drunk and overshare. I mean, that’s a big one right there. So if you’re gonna use these sites, that’s a big one. Really, really follow that one. And you’re probably gonna be a little bit of an awkward networker to begin with, but it’ll work its way out.

53:29
You know, and now, you know, as they proliferated, they are starting to cater then to, well, you know, if I’m a networker and I’m a woman, I’m like, I want to make the first move, you know? And so that is, you know, a style. And then within that, they give you content that you can engage on. So you have something to talk about. Like what you said about planning your meetings. they the topics, like, oh, well, you know, you guys align on this and you guys align on that. And these are the things you have in common, you know? So it’s…

53:57
as much about making a match as it is about giving you, again, fodder for content that you can actually talk to each other about and maybe potentially build a relationship out of it. So it all works in that standpoint to try to create connections, but also differentiates in a way that really caters to different ways that people like to network in the environments that they feel comfortable in which to do that. Yeah, yeah, no, really good point. And speaking from experience,

54:26
I will let you be the expert on this one and obviously the success there. maybe again, not the most intuitive example perhaps, but one that we just feel like takes networking in a direction that really works well. Did we spark something with this episode that you want to talk about further? Reach out to us through our website, ForthRight-People.com. We can help you customize what you have heard to move your business and make sure to follow or subscribe to Strategic Counsel on your favorite podcast platform!